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I agree about Andy, but Djokovic doesn't belong in that same sentence. His graciousness ends the moment the moment he shakes hands with his opponent. I have been watching Nole since he came on tour as well, and this is not the same champion that I've witnessed in the past. Ripping your shirt and bellowing like a lion does not come under class champion. Which is probably what I find most irksome about him as a whole. Who is he? One never knows from one minute to the next. What I can say about all of the other players is that this is how we came to know them. Rafa didn't start kicking and jumping up in celebration after he won a good number of slams. It's how we came to know him, so at that point I was able to make a decision. With Nole, I have no idea who he is from one tournament to the next. I guess he has too many personalities for me.
And, before he started winning majors he was always proclaiming how he, Rafa, and Andy were such great friends, but the moment he started winning he went on record saying how he couldn't possibly be friends with rivals. What? I can't get with people like that, because one of those statements are true, they can't both be true because they're contradictory.
Andy berating himself? I don't understand why people even bring that up. Who cares how someone internalizes their feelings? Andy, Rafa, Federer, or Novak have nothing to do with Pete. They're all unique individuals and each are allowed their space to be themselves. That's what makes sense; not that one should parrot the other. Individuality is a great thing in my book. I expect some to be flamboyant, stoic, ecstatic, etc. Variety is the spice of life.
Anyway, Nole isn't doing it so much anymore because many people didn't find it appealing and he has toned it down considerably. Good for him. It's the Jekyll and Hyde effect that I can't get with.
I've never seen any player behave this way. Ever.
The stuff Nadal used to wear (the cocky and apparent show off of masculinity) and some of his past celebrations have always put me off but I very rarely talk about these things. In fact, Federer and Nadal's finger waving is also something I brought up last night for the first time. I also don't read top player's post match transcripts to find out all the flaws about their opponents. These are all too insignificant for me to waste my time on it. However I only mentioned it because it was relevant to what herc was originally talking about yesterday.
I, for one, see nothing wrong with Nole's statement. He's never meant it to be disrespectful to his opponents. He didn't want to hang out with the likes of Andy, Rafa etc. since it's a very competitive sports and these top guys have to deal with each other quite often in the big stage of things, so it's not an ideal scenario at all for any of them. If anything, Nole was being very honest about his feelings. Even Eugene Bouchard has recently stated that she could no longer be friends with the British player Laura Robson stating the same reason. In the past, both I and some of Murray fans have agreed that Andy should not at all hang out with Nole and Rafa. Because he is so chummy with Nadal and Nole that he is unable to his best competitive nature against them and it's costing him big time. Nole did what he had to do and it was absolutely crucial for him and it paid off.
Nole has toned it down not because 'people' don't like it anymore but because it's no longer necessary (just like Nadal didn't do it as much after a few wins). He has already established the fact that he is just as good as Federer and Nadal and is now the best player in the world. He did that initially to state that he has arrived in the big picture in his cocky way. Nadal did the same after 2008.
And please don't tell me if I am entitled to like Andy's on-court behaviour or not. His on-court behaviour bothers me because it doesn't help him at all. He had lost it temporarily during Lendl season which had done him so good but now unfortunately, it has found its way back since Lendl departure. If he can't have handle on his behaviour thefore his emotion, he won't see much success in handling his game in time of need, because the situations require it. In fact, it demands it. Nole's behaviour is a prime example for this who happens to have the same type of game as Andy and yet, so much more successful than Andy. In the final stage, due to his this behaviour therefore, lack of confidence, Andy's unable to win against the top guys.
But I know deep down inside that had Nole had similar on-court behavioiur as Andy then the same fans would have found it very difficult to like it. It all comes down to who we like or dislike essentially for the agendas that we tend to carry. I strictly remember at T4U some Nadal fans really hating on Murray after he beat Nadal at the 2008 USO and 2010 AO, but now that Nadal has beaten him quite a few times since then, it's now water under he bridge. But Andy still has his fair share of Nadal fans who truly hate Andy. I've come across them at MTF in the past. In the end, it's all about carrying personal agendas because, ultimately, it's a competitive sport and anything that is of competitive nature is bound to have its nasty sides. Very rarely anyone watches the sport for the good reason there is.
If you are a big fan of Andy, as you say, then you would have supported Nole to win Paris, because Nole winning this tournament has the least negative affect on Andy's ranking that is the most crucial aspect of Andy's career right now. But I am sure both you and herc (as he too says he's a Murray fan) would want Nole to lose the tournament and I am fairly sure it has nothing to do with Nole's celebrations. When we are faced with the real truth, we often don't like it or look past it and that's the truth.
The stuff Nadal used to wear, the pirate pants are a part of the Spanish culture and what most of the players wear in that region of the world. Nike saw it, and decided to use it as a marketing ploy.
It’s OK if you don’t think Nole’s statement is disrespectful. I never said that it was, I said it was hypocritical. He said one thing before he started winning and a different thing when the winning began. What we view as disrespectful is in the eye of the beholder. My opinion differs. Everyone has reasons why they see things in a certain way and I respect that. I don’t think my opinion is any better than yours, but I also don’t think your opinion is any better than mine. I don't see that as a problem because I like differing opinions.
Bouchard? Please, her and Robson were best friends. Once she got Robson’s coach she announced that they were no longer friends; blindsiding Robson. Sounds like a nice girl. I guess I don’t like that particular brand of "honesty,” I don't see it as honesty, but duplicity. The notion of being competitive in order to reach the top doesn’t appeal to me, nor does it garner my respect. I don’t understand why you can’t compete on court and be a human being off it.
For whatever reason Nole thumped his chest, ripped his shirt, and bellowed like an idiot (IMO) is his perogative, but he also opened himself up to criticism and I choose to criticize him for it. However, I'm not mad at people who see it differently from. Freedom of expression and all. Anyway, I'm glad he did it because it was a turnoff to me and earned him the nicknames of DeJerk, and Djerkovic.
Don’t tell you? Fine, then don’t tell me about nationalism and rabid fanboyism, or how I should think. I am just as strong willed as you and I am not about to let anyone give me an opinion. Our thoughts are free and we are free to express them. Why do you get to express your opinions and chastise others and then get testy when someone responds to your behavior?
Fans who hate a player for any reason have a mental problem. Hate is too strong to waste on a complete stranger. The trick is to not attach that to other fans based on your own mindset. Tennis is a sport and as such there will be wins and losses. Anyone who doesn’t understand that needs help.
“If you are a big fan of Andy, as you say, then you would have supported Nole to win Paris, because Nole winning this tournament has the least negative affect on Andy's ranking that is the most crucial aspect of Andy's career right now. But I am sure both you and herc (as he too says he's a Murray fan) would want Nole to lose the tournament and I am fairly sure it has nothing to do with Nole's celebrations. When we are faced with the real truth, we often don't like it or look past it and that's the truth.”
This is total BS! I don’t care who wins the tournament. Two of my favorite players are Rafa and Murray. Once they’re out of the tournament I no longer have any dogs in the fight. Why would I care if Nole won it or not? He’s not one of my favorites. He’s in the same category as Kei, Milos, and anyone else left. I don’t think about the impact of rankings, points, or any of that stuff as it pertains to players. I’m happy for whoever wins the tournament, because they earned it. Why should I care? What’s in it for me? Seriously? Whoever wins the tournament, ends up #1, wins the next major has zero effect on my life. I wish I would be sitting around caring about stats that I cannot control. That is ludicrous, and if I say I’m a fan of Andy’s; then I am. I don’t have to please or appease anyone. I may not be the type of fan that you are, because outside of being able to enjoy a competitive match for me, it all ends there.
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I disagree, while countries do not "enforce" individual behaviors, they do share a certain type of cultures. For example, China is known for their humility and collectivism as a whole. That doesn't mean everyone within a culture adheres to the social mores of their geographical boundaries. Still, there is a lot that one can see in the differences, even in tournaments. The Australian Open seems to be a fun place, with friendly people, and much respect for the players and the sport; the same with the Argentinians, English, and the Spanish players.
Rafa being a bad loser. I totally disagree about that. I don't much about Bernie except what I hear out of the commentators mouths and I put little to know stock in that.
But of course we can always agree to disagree, because if anybody shows little class as a sportsman, IMO, it's Nole. Tearing off his shirts and having his team celebrating wins in his opponents face. It doesn't get any worse than that to me. I know he "says" reasonable things, but his actions belie his words.
Can't agree with that generalizations. I've first hand experience dealing with British people and know for a fact that they can be mean and a lot of them are mean and nasty. Doesn't matter how they behave at Wimbledon. That's definitely not a good sample to sweep such a generalization. They do look sober on the surface but that's not truly who they are. It's only a cultural thing and a superficial one. Perhaps that comes with their history. Ferrer put out pretty bad behaviours a few times and there are other incidences by other Spanish players I've seen over the years. Tomic is a spoiled brat but I don't dislike him for that. He's still young and has got himself a difficult father but they are both difficult IMO. Hewitt was cocky at first. I cut him slacks because he too was young.
Both Federer and Nadal are bad losers on occasions. I've seen it with my very eyes, barely shaking hands, giving cold shoulders to opponents who have just beaten them. No one's perfect. Nole is good loser but a bad winner. His celebration is over the top no doubt. Andy's self-berating nature is a put off. I don't mind if he calls out his own name when he misses a point and that's even cute but when he beats himself up, it's not at all cool or classy.
Sweeping generalizations? I'm talking about a small sampling of the ATP tour and its global athletes. I don't think anyone is talking about the countries themselves. I think you're mixing up nationalism with the small sampling of athletes others prefer who coincidentally hail from the same lands. Those are two different issues IMO. I don't know anything about the Argentinian, Spanish, European, or English culture, I'm only speaking about the players I like. Where they come from is incidental. They just happen to be from the same places.
Yes, but you did state this as well (see below). You did say you'd fit right into these cultures based on these players' behaviour. The argument contradicts each other and the sample size is too small to make a bigger statement. The fact is, you don't really know if you'd fit in. You only think you would but the reality is likely to be different.que pasa lady TT, emma, and the others.
I have found the English, Spanish, and the Australian players to be the classiest over the years.
of course you folks know that I am a huge fan of argentina players as well.
I like the Australian, English, and Argentinian players too. They are classy and lead me to believe that their culture is one that I would fit into.
I clearly said "leads me to believe," which is not a definitive statement. I would have never said that because knowing that I don't know all aspects of their culture alerts me that I cannot without a doubt accept things that I know not of. You misunderstood. -
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I agree about Andy, but Djokovic doesn't belong in that same sentence. His graciousness ends the moment the moment he shakes hands with his opponent. I have been watching Nole since he came on tour as well, and this is not the same champion that I've witnessed in the past. Ripping your shirt and bellowing like a lion does not come under class champion. Which is probably what I find most irksome about him as a whole. Who is he? One never knows from one minute to the next. What I can say about all of the other players is that this is how we came to know them. Rafa didn't start kicking and jumping up in celebration after he won a good number of slams. It's how we came to know him, so at that point I was able to make a decision. With Nole, I have no idea who he is from one tournament to the next. I guess he has too many personalities for me.
And, before he started winning majors he was always proclaiming how he, Rafa, and Andy were such great friends, but the moment he started winning he went on record saying how he couldn't possibly be friends with rivals. What? I can't get with people like that, because one of those statements are true, they can't both be true because they're contradictory.
Andy berating himself? I don't understand why people even bring that up. Who cares how someone internalizes their feelings? Andy, Rafa, Federer, or Novak have nothing to do with Pete. They're all unique individuals and each are allowed their space to be themselves. That's what makes sense; not that one should parrot the other. Individuality is a great thing in my book. I expect some to be flamboyant, stoic, ecstatic, etc. Variety is the spice of life.
Anyway, Nole isn't doing it so much anymore because many people didn't find it appealing and he has toned it down considerably. Good for him. It's the Jekyll and Hyde effect that I can't get with.
I've never seen any player behave this way. Ever.
That's Carlos Berlocq from Argentina btw.
Ha ha ha. You're turning this into something it isn't. -
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We see this sort of celebrations in a lot of sports. Players' get caught in the momentum.
Nigerian tabel tennis star Onaolapo was so overcome with emotion that he decided to pull his shorts down.
Some of Mohammad Ali's quotes are downright cocky (the ones below) but people like him so much that they tend to overlook these quotes. Actually I don't dislike them either. Somehow it suits him (very Godlike).
- My only fault is that I don't realize how great I really am.
- I am the greatest, I said that even before I knew I was.
But you get the point.
And people choose how they feel about it. Some people may like it, and others may not. It's a wash. Who cares? -
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Last night I was listening to one of Steve Wilde's interviews (I think) and there he mentioned about a British journalist who wrote something not so flattering about Obama in his article and posted it on his Facebook and the next thing he knew, his article was deleted overnight and his account was banned the next day.
Facebook, Twitter etc. are all very controlled environments. That's why I have nothing to do with these fake stuff. Freedom of speech, land of freedom are all an illusion created by the Governments. In reality, they don't exist. Reality is, we all live in a very controlled society by the people in power. Like religion, they create fear in people to have a firm control over the mass.
Anyway, I am off to save some of my close friends from their misery. In other words, I am going out with friends. The day is cloudy and gloomy and on the cooler side, but this is what makes me appreciate a sunny, bright day - the sharp contrasts of things that makes the personal preferences to come out.
Oh and daylight saving is upon us again as we change the time to 1 hour back tonight. Yay! Ha ha...but that reminds me, even time is an illusion created by man so that we can organize our lives on this planet.
That's fine that you feel that way. You're entitled. But, I am also entitled to feel the way that I feel. Why can't you understand that? I'm not mad if you feel that way. It doesn't change anything for me. -
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Very recently I watched an old episode of 48 Hours. It was about the serial killings in Texas bayous in the 80s spanning over a few decades. However the killing has stopped since the last decade and my guess is, the serial killer got older and unable to prowl as much or might have even died, who knows. About 30 or more girls, most being under 20, went missing and most of them were never found. Parents are still searching for answers. Local Police were never a big help as they simply dismissed all cases as being a 'run away' case so parents were left helpless and had to take matters at hand out of desperation but most importantly, to find out the truth. They even made a movie on this in 2011 called "Texas Killing Fields" (you can find it on NetFlix) but that movie, like any other Hollywood cliche, is a feel good movie and far from the real story (you need this episode to know this), as usual. So I wouldn't really recommend you to watch this. I would rather watch that 48 Hours. Why settle for fake stuff?
This then led me to do this little research of mine as I've come across so many American serial killer stories over the years that one really have to wonder about these things and here's what I found.
- America holds the notorious record of producing the most serial killers in the world. More than half what rest of the world has produced so far. Wiki has a very long list of all the American serial killers.
America also happens to be the country...
- where most school shootings have taken place (believe it or not, the shooting goes as far back as the 1700s)
- the most obese country in the world
- one of the top ten countries that are in deep debt
Those are some staggering stats I must say.
Staggering indeed Emma. Fascinating post.
We seem to have most freedom here so that could be a variable in the serial equation.
Americans are also able get their hands on deadly weapons fairly easily or so it appears -
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Congrats to nole and his fans.
That is his 600th match win.
He also becomes the first player to defend Bercy. -
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Gotta have respect for Djokovic, herc darling. It seems nothing can really distract him, even a fatherhood. He has high respect for what he does and he gives 100%. Only Federer I believe is just as dedicated. Nadal is close but he unable to sustain a long schedule and Andy has his own demons to deal with first, unfortunately but he has done really good in the past few weeks, so I am pretty happy with where things are at with him right now. He must be in a good place mentally too.
Anyway, like you, I am really hoping Andy will be able to snatch the home title this time. It's been long due now. If not Andy then I am going to have to settle with Nole followed by Nishikori etc. Just going with my personal favourites first. -
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Staggering indeed Emma. Fascinating post.
We seem to have most freedom here so that could be a variable in the serial equation.
Americans are also able get their hands on deadly weapons fairly easily or so it appears
You've made a couple of very good points, herc because most of the victims in serial killings are girls/women and the crimes are strictly of sexual nature first - the killing comes second. These serial killers - they enjoy both acts greatly. In fact, one serial killer went on to say and I quote, 'lock me up because all I think about is killing and if you let me go, I will continue to kill'.
Anyway, Girls have too much freedom to the point that they ignore any warnings and end up payin the price later. I love my freedom too but I am very cautious about how I move, where I go and who I hang out with to stay out of trouble. A lot of us just forget or just plain naive that we still live in a very animalistic society where consciousness hasn't developed yet. There are still people who have absolutely no remorse or whatsoever even in most developed countries like US, UK, Australia etc.
I love India but unfortunately women are abused there the most than any other country in the world and it's not by any particular religion but by all.
If we don't acknowledge these traits and trends then we won't be able to do anything about it. -
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Last night I was listening to one of Steve Wilde's interviews (I think) and there he mentioned about a British journalist who wrote something not so flattering about Obama in his article and posted it on his Facebook and the next thing he knew, his article was deleted overnight and his account was banned the next day.
Facebook, Twitter etc. are all very controlled environments. That's why I have nothing to do with these fake stuff. Freedom of speech, land of freedom are all an illusion created by the Governments. In reality, they don't exist. Reality is, we all live in a very controlled society by the people in power. Like religion, they create fear in people to have a firm control over the mass.
Anyway, I am off to save some of my close friends from their misery. In other words, I am going out with friends. The day is cloudy and gloomy and on the cooler side, but this is what makes me appreciate a sunny, bright day - the sharp contrasts of things that makes the personal preferences to come out.
Oh and daylight saving is upon us again as we change the time to 1 hour back tonight. Yay! Ha ha...but that reminds me, even time is an illusion created by man so that we can organize our lives on this planet.
That's fine that you feel that way. You're entitled. But, I am also entitled to feel the way that I feel. Why can't you understand that? I'm not mad if you feel that way. It doesn't change anything for me.
Have you gone insane or something? Because you are now quoting posts that have nothing to do with you or the argument we are having. I've never liked Facebook, Twitter etc. and I've mentioned that even before you existed on this forum. Just ask CD. I am not saying to you or herc that you should feel differently too. I am just stating my opinion which I am 100% entitled to. And I am also raising awareness. Whether it will make some sense to some or fall into deaf ears I don't know, but at the end of the day, I'd know I did try by stating my opinion and facts about these things. There's nothing else in it and no one is being forced. At the end of the day, I only care about living in a better world where there's less crime and we are not being controlled.
It's worth mentioning because I want to do you a great favour - whether it will make you think about things about yourself or not is up to you. You have this tendency to take every little thing way too personally even when they are not at all directed at you. On top of that, you feel the whole world is conspiring against you night and day. It's not. Let me tell you, if you live in that negative state for too long, you will attract all sorts of diseases which will be detrimental for your mental and physical health if it's not already. You need to wise up before that happens.
And know this, this is my thread. I post whatever comes to my mind. I don't follow any particular system or pattern in my thoughts and I don't follow any particular rules. I allow my mind to go any direction it wants to go to at any time. So even when I am in the midst of a discussion/argument with whomever, I'd still go and post completely unrelated stuff and if you see some sort of correlation to that then that's strictly your problem - not mine. But deal with it on your own rather than quoting me, because I have no reason to explain it to you since they don't concern you. Just like I talked about the left and right brain stuff not so long ago. I am sure if I were to post it now, you would have seen some sort of connection of a personal attack there too; whereas I simply posted what's on my mind.
Btw, my original post was to herc who mentioned that he liked specific players from specific countries and as a counter argument, I gave herc a different insight of things. You are the one who quoted my post because you didn't agree with it and you are unable to leave it alone whereas herc has moved on a long time ago. -
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That's Carlos Berlocq from Argentina btw.
Ha ha ha. You're turning this into something it isn't.
No, just making a valid point to your blanket and ignorant not to mention, biased comment about Nole. -
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And people choose how they feel about it. Some people may like it, and others may not. It's a wash. Who cares?
You do. Because you are the one who brought Nole and his winning celebration up and went on stating how much you don't like it. You say 'live and let live'. You clearly don't practice what you preach. If you did, then Nole's celebrations would have not been a problem for you because what Nole does after winning a match is not a crime nor it is illegal. In fact, it's perfectly normal.
Truth is, that is if you are really interested in it, you don't like Nole regardless because he is an imminent threat to your favourite player Nadal, who btw can do nothing wrong in your eyes. Nole is someone who has denied Nadal from winning several Slams and your negative feelings about Nole stems directly from there. Now you can write a dissertation about how it ain't true but I will be last person to buy it as I already know what the truth is. You use Nole's celebration as a smokescreen to cover your ultimate feelings about him - a man who's standing in the way of your man's ultimate success. You say you don't care about that but you care more than herc does.
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I clearly said "leads me to believe," which is not a definitive statement. I would have never said that because knowing that I don't know all aspects of their culture alerts me that I cannot without a doubt accept things that I know not of. You misunderstood.
There's nothing wrong with what you said; however, if I see it's misleading then I have no reason to stay quite about it.
herc can like any series of players from any country and I have no problems with that but I am careful about misleading information and if I see fit, I will let that know. People read forums and I want them to read something that is true to reality and not some random take of things. We are both entitled. -
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Last night I was listening to one of Steve Wilde's interviews (I think) and there he mentioned about a British journalist who wrote something not so flattering about Obama in his article and posted it on his Facebook and the next thing he knew, his article was deleted overnight and his account was banned the next day.
Facebook, Twitter etc. are all very controlled environments. That's why I have nothing to do with these fake stuff. Freedom of speech, land of freedom are all an illusion created by the Governments. In reality, they don't exist. Reality is, we all live in a very controlled society by the people in power. Like religion, they create fear in people to have a firm control over the mass.
Anyway, I am off to save some of my close friends from their misery. In other words, I am going out with friends. The day is cloudy and gloomy and on the cooler side, but this is what makes me appreciate a sunny, bright day - the sharp contrasts of things that makes the personal preferences to come out.
Oh and daylight saving is upon us again as we change the time to 1 hour back tonight. Yay! Ha ha...but that reminds me, even time is an illusion created by man so that we can organize our lives on this planet.
That's fine that you feel that way. You're entitled. But, I am also entitled to feel the way that I feel. Why can't you understand that? I'm not mad if you feel that way. It doesn't change anything for me.
Have you gone insane or something? Because you are now quoting posts that have nothing to do with you or the argument we are having. I've never liked Facebook, Twitter etc. and I've mentioned that even before you existed on this forum. Just ask CD. I am not saying to your or to herc that you should feel differently too. I am just stating my opinion which I am 100% entitled to. And I am also raising awareness. Whether it will make some sense to some or fall into deaf ears I don't know, but at the end of the day, I'd know I did try by stating my opinion and facts about these things. There's nothing else in it and no one is being forced. At the end of the day, I only care about living in a better world where there's less crime and we are not being controlled.
It's worth mentioning because I want to do you a great favour - whether it will make you think about things about yourself or not is up to you. You have this tendency to take every little thing way too personally even when they are not at all directed at you. On top of that, you feel the whole world is conspiring against you night and day. It's not. Let me tell you, if you live in that negative state for too long, you will attract all sorts of diseases which will be detrimental for your mental and physical health if it's not already. You need to wise up before that happens.
And know this, this is my thread. I post whatever comes to my mind. I don't follow any particular system or pattern in my thoughts and I don't follow any particular rules. I allow my mind to go any direction it wants to go to at any time. So even when I am in the midst of a discussion/argument with whomever, I'd still go and post completely unrelated stuff and if you see some sort of correlation to that then that's strictly your problem - not mine. But deal with it on your own rather than quoting me, because I have no reason to explain it to you since they don't concern you. Just like I talked about the left and right brain stuff not so long ago. I am sure if I were to post it now, you would have seen some sort of connection of a personal attack there too; whereas I simply posted what's on my mind.
Btw, my original post was to herc who mentioned that he liked specific players from specific countries and as a counter argument, I gave herc a different insight of things. You are the one who quoted my post because you didn't agree with it and you are unable to leave it alone whereas herc has moved on a long time ago.
You'll have to refresh my memory because I have no idea what you're talking about with Facebook, but your opening statement about being insane is the very thing that I find insulting. You are good at saying such things, posters are unenlightened, rabid, insane, etc. Why do you talk to people that way?
I agree about stating your opinion. I am doing the same thing; stating my opinion, but when I did you came back with videos of Nadal to do what? Restate your opinion again? Or in response to me having an opinion? So, your actions are quite contradictory. You state an opinion. Others state an opinion, you restate your opinion with videos to prove it, I respond, but I'm the one that's insane? That makes no sense at all.
"And I am also raising awareness."
What? Are you kidding me? You are raising whose awareness? Who has not been able to get through life without your help, or asked for it?"
You are so good at taking potshots and making negative statements about everyone else's opinions. Thanks anyway, but I wouldn't take advice from you. Spare me your largesse. I will say what I want to, just like you do. Nice touch with the diseases comment. I wouldn't expect anything less from you.
I'm attacking you? No, just defending my right to an opinion. -
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The stuff Nadal used to wear, the pirate pants are a part of the Spanish culture and what most of the players wear in that region of the world. Nike saw it, and decided to use it as a marketing ploy.
It’s OK if you don’t think Nole’s statement is disrespectful. I never said that it was, I said it was hypocritical. He said one thing before he started winning and a different thing when the winning began. What we view as disrespectful is in the eye of the beholder. My opinion differs. Everyone has reasons why they see things in a certain way and I respect that. I don’t think my opinion is any better than yours, but I also don’t think your opinion is any better than mine. I don't see that as a problem because I like differing opinions.
Bouchard? Please, her and Robson were best friends. Once she got Robson’s coach she announced that they were no longer friends; blindsiding Robson. Sounds like a nice girl. I guess I don’t like that particular brand of "honesty,” I don't see it as honesty, but duplicity. The notion of being competitive in order to reach the top doesn’t appeal to me, nor does it garner my respect. I don’t understand why you can’t compete on court and be a human being off it.
For whatever reason Nole thumped his chest, ripped his shirt, and bellowed like an idiot (IMO) is his perogative, but he also opened himself up to criticism and I choose to criticize him for it. However, I'm not mad at people who see it differently from. Freedom of expression and all. Anyway, I'm glad he did it because it was a turnoff to me and earned him the nicknames of DeJerk, and Djerkovic.
Don’t tell you? Fine, then don’t tell me about nationalism and rabid fanboyism, or how I should think. I am just as strong willed as you and I am not about to let anyone give me an opinion. Our thoughts are free and we are free to express them. Why do you get to express your opinions and chastise others and then get testy when someone responds to your behavior?
Fans who hate a player for any reason have a mental problem. Hate is too strong to waste on a complete stranger. The trick is to not attach that to other fans based on your own mindset. Tennis is a sport and as such there will be wins and losses. Anyone who doesn’t understand that needs help.
“If you are a big fan of Andy, as you say, then you would have supported Nole to win Paris, because Nole winning this tournament has the least negative affect on Andy's ranking that is the most crucial aspect of Andy's career right now. But I am sure both you and herc (as he too says he's a Murray fan) would want Nole to lose the tournament and I am fairly sure it has nothing to do with Nole's celebrations. When we are faced with the real truth, we often don't like it or look past it and that's the truth.”
This is total BS! I don’t care who wins the tournament. Two of my favorite players are Rafa and Murray. Once they’re out of the tournament I no longer have any dogs in the fight. Why would I care if Nole won it or not? He’s not one of my favorites. He’s in the same category as Kei, Milos, and anyone else left. I don’t think about the impact of rankings, points, or any of that stuff as it pertains to players. I’m happy for whoever wins the tournament, because they earned it. Why should I care? What’s in it for me? Seriously? Whoever wins the tournament, ends up #1, wins the next major has zero effect on my life. I wish I would be sitting around caring about stats that I cannot control. That is ludicrous, and if I say I’m a fan of Andy’s; then I am. I don’t have to please or appease anyone. I may not be the type of fan that you are, because outside of being able to enjoy a competitive match for me, it all ends there.
But why do you want to decide things for Nole as to how he should be before and after? How he should behave after a win? Why must everything be to your liking? Who are you to him? It's not a crime if he feels differently about things now? It's not illegal to celebrate the way he wants to celebrate? You don't want to please anyone but then why should anyone please you? It's his life and HE gets to decide how he is going to interact with others. And the way he sees it fit. And I am not a fan of Bouchard by any means but I am not holding that against her. That was to merely show you a point. You can continue to dislike Nole for whatever reason but you can't question his way of doing things, especially when it's doing no harm to others. That's the objective here not to mention, the main point.
I wish though things were that simple with you but unfortunately, they are not. You do care who won Paris because you did express your feelings about it on the Paris thread. Here's what you wrote: "Watching the end of the Ferrer/Nishikori match and hoping that Kei pulls it out. He'll give Novak more to think about, whereas Ferrer will fold at the sight of most players with a #1 next to their name. Come Kei!!!". You obviously cared enough to post that. It's no hidden gem as to who you wanted to win in the end and for whatever reasons.
All those things I've highlighted to show you a point that you truly dislike Nole (and it has very little to do with his celebration) because you went on to even post some really stupid nicknames perhaps given by fans (Nadal fans I bet) who too hate him. And then quite ironically you state that fans who hate a player for no reason has a mental problem. Now who's hating who? All I see is you hating on Nole in the name of his celebrations. I brought Nadal up to give you a counter point. I brought Nadal's choice of wardrobe up for the same reason. I had no other intention. It's a put off yes, but in the end, I don't care - I don't talk about it on a regular basis (or ever) nor do I have any genuine problems with his way of celebrations. As to nicknames, are you completely oblivious to the fact that Nadal too have notorious nicknames given by his naysayers and a series of Nadal's own questionable doings have opened up the door for criticism to many as well? Yes, you are both entitled if you must call players by stupid names if it makes you happy, but this then becomes children's playground - a tit for tat game - with all the childish name callings.
Anyway, I grew up hearing one thing and that is, women can't let an argument go and they really and truly want to win all arguments, because they so desperately want to be right and they love to have the last words. And I never wanted to be that woman so this is my last post on this but you have the floor. You are free to post whatever you like and wherever you like but on this matter, I am going to tune you out because otherwise this will continue, so I want to wise up and leave things at that. And whether you like Nole or not makes no difference in my life either; in fact, in sports it's quite legitimate but that doesn't mean I am going to buy everything I see or read that's on the superficial level. -