CAMELOT FANTASIES

Good day everyone!

Given that these top players all have a lot of ability, FITNESS these days, especially on the slower courts  from AO Open to Roland Garros, appears to be the major differentiator when both players are in good form and the ability is relatively equal.  Right now, Djokovic is above the rest in my opinion.

Here is how I rank the top 10 players fitness based on their most recent play that I've seen.  The little v means I think there is a level of difference between that player and the next.

1. Djokovic [1] (He has taken fitness and flexibility to a new level.  I don't know what he's doing, but it's working. Ability wise, I place him below Federer and Nadal, and maybe even Murray, but his fitness and flexibility translating into superb movement, stamina, and ability to recover quickly in matches and between matches takes him above that group)
v

2.  Ferrer [7] (he is at a lower ability level than most of the top 10, but in his 33rd year, his superb fitness and spirit still puts him right behind the top guys)

3.  Federer [2] (Well into his 34th year, he is still physically prepared to outlast everyone except for Djokovic. Right now he is training on clay with young Dominic Thiem and others in the build up to Monte Carlo and the clay season. He has targeted training where he works on something and doesn't let up until he thinks he is just about perfect and has hit his target. Kyrgios said that about Federer when he trained with him last year prior to RG and Wimbledon).
v

4. Nishikori [4] (Under his coach Chang, his fitness has improved probably 3 fold. He is not getting as many injuries, and he has one of the best, it not the best deciding set records in the last two years)
v

5. Murray [3] (his level of fitness and play definitely declined after Wimbledon 2013, mostly due to his back, and then the recovery. His level of play this year finally seems to have mostly recovered, but he is still coming up short against the fittest players)

6. Wawrinka [9] (he fluctuates in fitness, varying from pretty fit (Nishikori level) to looking like he had too many hamburgers, so I put him here)
v

7. Nadal [5] (he might be above Raonic, Berdych, and Cilic, but their games are so different they doesn't need quite the same fitness, for Nadal it is essential).  It's a bit sad that I place him here, because I always considered Rafa #1 in fitness for years, probably peaking in 2008, but in 2009 injuries took some toll, and then definitely after his 2010 3 slam year I think he relaxed, and then after his excellent 2013, even more so, to the point where I was almost shocked at his fitness. He had a relatively poor clay season by his standards in 2014, but still managed to win Roland Garros, but that was it, and in 2015, has dropped even further in fitness and match playing levels after mishaps in the latter portion of 2014. I think he needs to get up to at least Nishikori level of fitness and preferably higher to stop these losses to players to whom he should not be losing.  He is in danger of dropping from top 10 if there is no improvement in the clay season.  I think and hope there will be, but we will see)

8. Raonic [6] (his fitness has improved, but it is not at the same level of the rest, but then is game is much different and he doesn't rely on it as much. Still, I think it wouldn't hurt him to drop a few more.
v

9. Berdych [8] (see Raonic and game style, not really as much improvement fitness wise though, he's a big guy and wouldn't hurt him to be quicker around the court)
v

10. Cilic [10] (like Raonic as well in game style, but still getting hurt a lot, probably needs to try and work on flexibility and some targeted training for problem areas of his body)


That's how I see it.  Please feel free to agree or disagree and come up with your own list and opinions.

Respectfully,
masterclass

I guess Ferrer is "fitter" than Roger, but it's hard to know since Roger's a much better match player than Ferrer. Sometimes Ferrer goes away in tough matches, is it fitness or lack of confidence.

Nishikori? Somethings just not right with him for me. Sophomore slump possibly, but he isn't looking that sharp or hungry to me. He's fit, but towards the end of the tournament he seems to be slower to the ball and not as much power on his shots. Maybe he'll rebound this year, but since the loss at the USO he's seemed stagnant to me.

Murray is a head scratcher for me right now. He may still be learning to trust his body, but his passion doesn't seem to quite be there. He seems confused about what he wants to do. In his right mind, he should have won that first from Novak, he broke him three times and got broken back. Confused, and then a bagel in the third. Somethings off in his head, to me, I don't think it's about fitness though.

Wawrinka is another question mark. Since his big win he hasn't been very dependable. He fluctuates too wildly and you can't depend on him from one tournament to the next. I don't know if it's fitness or something going on in his head, because he seems to be thinking too much. Thoughts like he should win a match over a lower ranked player, and losing focus in the middle of a match.

Nadal, it's hard to say whether it's fitness or rustiness at this point. I know that fitness gives you  confidence, but coming back from injury also gives you doubts. So, I don't know where Rafa is, we'll see as the season wears on

I would switch Berdych and Raonic because Berdych gets to more balls, but Raonic comes forward more, but is easier to get out of position.

Weird with Cilic, I don't remember him being so hurt in the past, maybe he was and I just didn't notice it, but maybe it has to do with height, similar to del Potro. Both of them shot up like comets, but also came back to earth with a thud.

Or, I can probably just go along with your whole post, because you know tennis better than me, LOL.

I agree General. Excellent points.  I remember seeing pictures of Rafa cycling a few years ago but I haven't seen him doing it lately.
I guess he is too busy with other things these days.  I hear he is going to be more involved with his tennis academy and is opening it next year.



Respectfully,
masterclass

I am seein videos of rafa practice sessions.

He won't change a thing. Still parked permanently in his backhand corner trying to hit all forehands.

This is no good. I am 100 per certain that he is not listening to anybody around.

Tony couldn't possibly be that stupid.

Rafa just doesn't care to hit backhands.

He is basically giving you more than 1/2 of the court in matches. This is why fognini hit 15 outright backhand winners into the space so generously provided by Rafa.

So he is just compounding his issues left and right.


Also he should have taken a wildcard in Casablanca.

I look at Rafa these days and I am looking at a player who wants to win matches obviously but simply refuses  to put in the hard yards.


If he loses early in Monte Carlo, Barcelona, and Rome, he can pretty much kiss his season goodbye.


More on this later.

Quote from: thetruth on April 08, 2015, 06:52:25 am

Quote from: masterclass on April 08, 2015, 03:58:17 am

Good day everyone!

Given that these top players all have a lot of ability, FITNESS these days, especially on the slower courts  from AO Open to Roland Garros, appears to be the major differentiator when both players are in good form and the ability is relatively equal.  Right now, Djokovic is above the rest in my opinion.

Here is how I rank the top 10 players fitness based on their most recent play that I've seen.  The little v means I think there is a level of difference between that player and the next.

1. Djokovic [1] (He has taken fitness and flexibility to a new level.  I don't know what he's doing, but it's working. Ability wise, I place him below Federer and Nadal, and maybe even Murray, but his fitness and flexibility translating into superb movement, stamina, and ability to recover quickly in matches and between matches takes him above that group)
v

2.  Ferrer [7] (he is at a lower ability level than most of the top 10, but in his 33rd year, his superb fitness and spirit still puts him right behind the top guys)

3.  Federer [2] (Well into his 34th year, he is still physically prepared to outlast everyone except for Djokovic. Right now he is training on clay with young Dominic Thiem and others in the build up to Monte Carlo and the clay season. He has targeted training where he works on something and doesn't let up until he thinks he is just about perfect and has hit his target. Kyrgios said that about Federer when he trained with him last year prior to RG and Wimbledon).
v

4. Nishikori [4] (Under his coach Chang, his fitness has improved probably 3 fold. He is not getting as many injuries, and he has one of the best, it not the best deciding set records in the last two years)
v

5. Murray [3] (his level of fitness and play definitely declined after Wimbledon 2013, mostly due to his back, and then the recovery. His level of play this year finally seems to have mostly recovered, but he is still coming up short against the fittest players)

6. Wawrinka [9] (he fluctuates in fitness, varying from pretty fit (Nishikori level) to looking like he had too many hamburgers, so I put him here)
v

7. Nadal [5] (he might be above Raonic, Berdych, and Cilic, but their games are so different they doesn't need quite the same fitness, for Nadal it is essential).  It's a bit sad that I place him here, because I always considered Rafa #1 in fitness for years, probably peaking in 2008, but in 2009 injuries took some toll, and then definitely after his 2010 3 slam year I think he relaxed, and then after his excellent 2013, even more so, to the point where I was almost shocked at his fitness. He had a relatively poor clay season by his standards in 2014, but still managed to win Roland Garros, but that was it, and in 2015, has dropped even further in fitness and match playing levels after mishaps in the latter portion of 2014. I think he needs to get up to at least Nishikori level of fitness and preferably higher to stop these losses to players to whom he should not be losing.  He is in danger of dropping from top 10 if there is no improvement in the clay season.  I think and hope there will be, but we will see)

8. Raonic [6] (his fitness has improved, but it is not at the same level of the rest, but then is game is much different and he doesn't rely on it as much. Still, I think it wouldn't hurt him to drop a few more.
v

9. Berdych [8] (see Raonic and game style, not really as much improvement fitness wise though, he's a big guy and wouldn't hurt him to be quicker around the court)
v

10. Cilic [10] (like Raonic as well in game style, but still getting hurt a lot, probably needs to try and work on flexibility and some targeted training for problem areas of his body)


That's how I see it.  Please feel free to agree or disagree and come up with your own list and opinions.

Respectfully,
masterclass

I guess Ferrer is "fitter" than Roger, but it's hard to know since Roger's a much better match player than Ferrer. Sometimes Ferrer goes away in tough matches, is it fitness or lack of confidence.

Nishikori? Somethings just not right with him for me. Sophomore slump possibly, but he isn't looking that sharp or hungry to me. He's fit, but towards the end of the tournament he seems to be slower to the ball and not as much power on his shots. Maybe he'll rebound this year, but since the loss at the USO he's seemed stagnant to me.

Murray is a head scratcher for me right now. He may still be learning to trust his body, but his passion doesn't seem to quite be there. He seems confused about what he wants to do. In his right mind, he should have won that first from Novak, he broke him three times and got broken back. Confused, and then a bagel in the third. Somethings off in his head, to me, I don't think it's about fitness though.

Wawrinka is another question mark. Since his big win he hasn't been very dependable. He fluctuates too wildly and you can't depend on him from one tournament to the next. I don't know if it's fitness or something going on in his head, because he seems to be thinking too much. Thoughts like he should win a match over a lower ranked player, and losing focus in the middle of a match.

Nadal, it's hard to say whether it's fitness or rustiness at this point. I know that fitness gives you  confidence, but coming back from injury also gives you doubts. So, I don't know where Rafa is, we'll see as the season wears on

I would switch Berdych and Raonic because Berdych gets to more balls, but Raonic comes forward more, but is easier to get out of position.

Weird with Cilic, I don't remember him being so hurt in the past, maybe he was and I just didn't notice it, but maybe it has to do with height, similar to del Potro. Both of them shot up like comets, but also came back to earth with a thud.

Or, I can probably just go along with your whole post, because you know tennis better than me, LOL.

Not at all Lady TT, I enjoy hearing all points of view, even if I may not agree, as long as they seem fairly sensible.  

Re Andy: Maybe you did not hear that a little after the second set,  Murray shouted toward the trainer in his box,  "I'm done! Nice job!" Then in the post match interview he said that his legs were hurting/exhausted in the 3rd and he just couldn't do it.  So.... I don't know what to say.  Murray tired after 2 sets in his home away from home (where he trains)?  Maybe he is not pacing himself well during the match. He was guns blazing in the first set, put out a lot of energy, but unfortunately for him, lost the tiebreaker.  He then had to put a lot of energy to win the second as well.  The way he played it, he needed to get it done in two, and basically he said he didn't have it for the third.

But you have some points about the others.  Wawrinka may be satiated at this point.  He won a major, and he won the Davis Cup with Federer.  I think he has accomplished all he dreamed of doing.  So it may be lack of motivation for him, I think in some ways similar to Murray after winning Wimbledon in 2013, which he said was a lifetime dream come true.  I think it is no surprise really.

Respectfully,
masterclass

I saw an article earlier and Murray was saying that he couldn't explain why he didn't have any more gas in his legs, and I meant to read it, but didn't right away and now I can't find it. But, I forgot that he was getting married in a few weeks, so that may also be a factor.

That was quite a year for Stan, so it's understandable if he's lacking in energy and focus. We have to remember that they're human and tennis can't be everything without sacrificing other important aspects of your life. I don't know how they do it anyway, but if I'm not feeling it, no risk or reward is too great for me. I simply won't do it, whatever it is.

Monte Carlo draw takes place on Saturday.

Uncle Toni: Rafael Nadal Will Need A Little Luck To Get Back In Form, But It Will Happen
by Tom Gainey | April 10th, 2015, 9:54 am

http://www.tennis-x.com/xblog/2015-04-10/19015.php

In a new interview with Efe promoting his new book “Todo se puede entrenar”, Rafael Nadal’s coach and uncle, Toni Nadal, says his nephew will not settle for less than best.

    I don’t think that’s the reason for his inconsistent play at the moment. Rafael has the same desire to do things well. He’s never settled for less during all these years, and there would be no reason for him to do so now. Rafael is an athlete who likes to win and doesn’t like to lose. I don’t think he’s been settling for less.

Toni called Rafa’s recent confidence issues as temporary

    What had always been Rafael’s strength hasn’t been in recent tournaments. That mental strength that he had to overcome difficulties, it’s harder to come by right now. But we’re working to get it back. It’s a temporary issue, and as he plays matches and we’re lucky to win an important match (and then) several in a row, Rafael will recover the form he had before his (last year’s wrist) injury.
 
  It’s not easy because in a given situation you can tell him not to get tense, but there’ll be a day when, even when that’s the case, he can keep playing. It has to come. It’ll come with work, with reflection, and a little luck.
And Uncle Toni says a 10th French Open title in two months would be a cure-all, and a sign that Rafa is truly back to form.

Uncle ToniRafael Nadal Will Need A Little Luck To Get Back In Form But It Will Happen
by Tom Gainey | April 10th, 2015, 9:54 am

http://www.tennis-x.com/xblog/2015-04-10/19015.php

In a new interview with Efe promoting his new book “Todo se puede entrenar”, Rafael Nadal’s coach and uncle, Toni Nadal, says his nephew will not settle for less than best.

    I don’t think that’s the reason for his inconsistent play at the moment. Rafael has the same desire to do things well. He’s never settled for less during all these years, and there would be no reason for him to do so now. Rafael is an athlete who likes to win and doesn’t like to lose. I don’t think he’s been settling for less.

Toni called Rafa’s recent confidence issues as temporary.

    What had always been Rafael’s strength hasn’t been in recent tournaments. That mental strength that he had to overcome difficulties, it’s harder to come by right now. But we’re working to get it back. It’s a temporary issue, and as he plays matches and we’re lucky to win an important match (and then) several in a row, Rafael will recover the form he had before his (last year’s wrist) injury.

    It’s not easy because in a given situation you can tell him not to get tense, but there’ll be a day when, even when that’s the case, he can keep playing. It has to come. It’ll come with work, with reflection, and a little luck.

And Uncle Toni says a 10th French Open title in two months would be a cure-all, and a sign that Rafa is truly back to form.

I don't care how many spins others put on this.


it is NOT a crises of confidence. you are 1 of the 2-3 greatest players ever lived and you have a winning record against 100% of the top 30 players. and you are in your prime.

and you have owned some players for a decade. like ferru, almagro, and verdasco for example.

they could not beat him in the past even when he was limping around.



and now you are going to believe that he has confidence issues against these players.


horse ****. nobody who knows and understands the sport will buy that.


he is not consistent and he is not fit. and he continues to make terrible decisions. for one thing he simply refuses to put in the very hard yards required to dominate the sport. both on the practice courts and on the fitness front.

that is why the dramatic drop in rankings which is about to get worse.

this is not rocket science. tony himself said that rafa is not consistent anymore.


his other coach---roig--- said that rafa has always won in the past even with the injuries. and now he has none and he is not winning.


uncle tony really cant say publicly or even privately that rafa is not working hard enough.

rafa calls all the shots. rafa is going to do things his way.


he lost some drive and his relentless hunger to win a while back. and then 3 other factors took away some more focus:


1. he has too many outside interests which take away his valuable time. the tennis academy and golf could have waited 2 years. soon he will have $400 million and 50 years to do nothing but mess around on the golf courses and tennis academies. there was no need for all that poker either. precious time thrown away for the sake of money. slams are worth far more money and also bring him closer to the record. he has a contract with poker stars.

2. he is a global superstar of the highest order so there is immense demand for his time and he almost always gives in

3. injuries further slowed him down


but the good news is that he is now 100% healthy.



so now he is faced with a decision which he has still not made. he has to completely rededicate himself to the sport or face the prospects of dropping out of top 20 at the current rate.

can he turn this around in the short run? I doubt it but there is such a thing as luck in the sport.

he needs matches. he should have taken a wild card to Casablanca but chose instead to continue with fairly relaxed practice sessions with his close friend monaco.

that was a bad decision. he should have never gone to Miami and taken a wild card to Casablanca.

and practiced with 3-4 hitting partners 6 hours a day on the red clay prior to Casablanca.


rafa said it was too short a turnaround from Miami to monte carlo.


he never should have never gone to Miami with RG about to slip away from him.

and he risked injury on those hard courts prior to the single most important clay season of his career.



I am not happy with him but he is my player in this life and the next.



and with that said, only he has the right to decide what he wants.


it is his life and his career.

he could look to roger and serena for motivation. I hope that can re-ignite his fire from within.