CAMELOT FANTASIES

Quote from: Clay Death on August 13, 2015, 09:08:26 am

Quote from: thetruth on August 13, 2015, 05:23:56 am

Rafa's level of play wasn't that good. He'll be out in the next couple of rounds, but what is encouraging is that he was engaged. But losing serve twice when serving for the set and match in a not-so-competitive match? Maybe there was a little improvement but the players ranked in the 40's will run him ragged.  He's going to have to train hard for the 2016 season if he wants to have a chance. The ? is, does he want it enough to do that?

agreed.

I remain worried.



my biggest worry is that he is going to get hurt and that will be the end.


I don't know why he is doing this. this is not rocket science.


he cant beat these guys with his current game and his remedial fitness.



I don't know why he cant train 7-8 hours a day. you break that into 2 long workouts.



what is the point in losing to these unknown players when he owned winning records against all of the top 30 players.



why go to battle unprepared.

It's so baffling in one way, but then again, it kind of backs up what he's been saying all along. I don't remember Rafa making claims that he wanted to be the greatest or even play after a certain point. I think he was satisfied with where he was and grateful to have gotten there, but the thought of chasing status never seemed to be a priority for him. That's what you need if you want to scale new heights. There's been many times that he's said that he wasn't trying to catch Federer and I think he meant it. He was playing for himself, not the history books.

In that sense he's already accomplished more than he ever dreamed of. Nothing about his background suggests that he would have the same ardor as other top players. As soon as a big tournament is over he heads straight back to Mallorca to relax with family and friends and work on his foundation.

He reminds me of Lleyton Hewitt so much. They both play for the love of the game and being competitive, not the love of external things. That's why they can accept losses so easily and continue to suit up. I think Rafa will play until he no longer enjoys it, but it will be for his reasons and no one else.

If he was concerned about staying the best, becoming the major leader he would make changes. That's what you do when you're focused on a particular goal. He would hire a world class physio, train in eight hour blocks, and fix the problems he has in his game. Right now I think he's only playing for the fans who clamor to see him on court and he doesn't want to disappoint them, but as for his own goals, he's satisfied with what he has done.

If it wasn't for the fans, I think he'd quit and go live his life.

It's hard to explain, but I understand it. I find it vulgar to chase about status. I don't feel that I need to prove anything to anyone and the thought of proving others wrong means nothing to me. When I was in karate my sensei wanted to make me his star pupil because I was a natural. But those were his dreams not mine and I felt no obligation to fulfill his desires. I didn't need to be a champion I was doing karate for myself. To strengthen my body and mind and push myself to its limits. I walked away when something else took my interest away. My sensei kept trying to get me to come back, but I had accomplished my goals and was done. The trophies that were gathering dust in my basement were put out in the trash, but what I'd done was inside of me.

A good example of Rafa's mindset was the AO 2009. After that grueling SF with Verdasco he was beat and wasn't going to play the final. If it hadn't been for Uncle Toni he wouldn't have competed at all. It was his relentless will to win at that time that got him through. Also, when he was beating Novak and Andy at a good clip, he always respected their talent. He never thought he was "better" than them but thought they were very worthy opponents. Many people don't understand that. They say, "he can't be that humble and be that good" but the opposite is true. No matter how good you are, the strength is in knowing both your strengths and weaknesses. To pretend that you have no weaknesses is foolish. And talking "confident" means nothing. If people are silly enough to buy into that, that's on them. Saying I'm not playing well is the truth, period. What's the point of saying otherwise? The thing about the fake it tll you make it, is BS to me. The problem with that attitude is that it's fake, how is that good? I don't think you need to assure people that you've still got it speaks to a need for validation. If I'm playing bad, I'm playing bad. Why would I have to need to convince others?

Rafa will ultimately decide whether he wants to go on and records, status, and history in the game will not be a priority for him. He will be satisfied with what he accomplished. Will he regret it later? He might, but if given the same choice I think he'd opt for the same decision.

Everyone is unique and no one is held to anyone else's standards. That's what so many people don't seem to understand. The only person you should ever choose to prove anything to is yourself, everything else is incidental.

great post.




I think you hit on most the points. you are spot on.




he really doesn't want to bother with the brutal training and the endless focus required to dominate the sport.


he walked away from the sport.


more on this later.

Quote from: thetruth on August 13, 2015, 06:39:22 pm

Why did these idiots switch from the Rafa match to the Serena match which is most likely a done deal? So far, Rafa was looking pretty decent. He had better footing and court positioning, and some passion. He's looking better on the hard than he did on the clay. Baffling.

Did you hear all the furor that Kyrgios created? That guy is mental. They can classify it as charismatic all they want to, but no one can defend his latest outburst. He and Stan came to blows in the locker room. He made comments about Stan and his young girlfriend and then said that Kokkinakis, his friend, slept with her. All of this happened on court. Did he learn anything? No, today he came out and acted the same way, even threatened to fight a fan in the crowd. He was booed when he came on the court and when he left. They say he's been this way all his career and no one has challenged him because of his talent.

When Isner had to play him today, Gimelstob said that were calling John telling him to please beat Nick. They also want him suspended for his foul behavior and they want the umpires to start calling him for all the audible obscenities and breaking of rackets. This is why the five seconds over is so ridiculous. The things Nick has done are ridiculous and they haven't fined for practically anything. How crazy is that?

Is this a secret society where we decide who we will penalize and who we let escape penalty? It sure seems to be the case.

they slapped Nick with  $10,000.00 fine.



he is out to make a name for himself one way or another.


I am glad Isner sent him home today.



I will look for the highlights of the Rafa match later tonight.


maybe he can pull a small miracle here. we will hope anyway.

With possible additional fines added. They have to take this seriously. The guy is mental.

Rafa has Kei in his draw. I doubt he'll be ready for him, but he is doing so much better on HC and improving, but I doubt he'll be back in this tournament, though I wish that he coul.

Gulbis had a chance to take out djokovic but it was just not meant to be:


http://www.livescore.in/tennis/



Chardy takes down mighty john isner.

Quote from: Clay Death on August 13, 2015, 09:08:26 am

Quote from: thetruth on August 13, 2015, 05:23:56 am

Rafa's level of play wasn't that good. He'll be out in the next couple of rounds, but what is encouraging is that he was engaged. But losing serve twice when serving for the set and match in a not-so-competitive match? Maybe there was a little improvement but the players ranked in the 40's will run him ragged.  He's going to have to train hard for the 2016 season if he wants to have a chance. The ? is, does he want it enough to do that?

agreed.

I remain worried.



my biggest worry is that he is going to get hurt and that will be the end.


I don't know why he is doing this. this is not rocket science.


he cant beat these guys with his current game and his remedial fitness.



I don't know why he cant train 7-8 hours a day. you break that into 2 long workouts.



what is the point in losing to these unknown players when he owned winning records against all of the top 30 players.



why go to battle unprepared.

It's so baffling in one way, but then again, it kind of backs up what he's been saying all along. I don't remember Rafa making claims that he wanted to be the greatest or even play after a certain point. I think he was satisfied with where he was and grateful to have gotten there, but the thought of chasing status never seemed to be a priority for him. That's what you need if you want to scale new heights. There's been many times that he's said that he wasn't trying to catch Federer and I think he meant it. He was playing for himself, not the history books.

In that sense he's already accomplished more than he ever dreamed of. Nothing about his background suggests that he would have the same ardor as other top players. As soon as a big tournament is over he heads straight back to Mallorca to relax with family and friends and work on his foundation.

He reminds me of Lleyton Hewitt so much. They both play for the love of the game and being competitive, not the love of external things. That's why they can accept losses so easily and continue to suit up. I think Rafa will play until he no longer enjoys it, but it will be for his reasons and no one else.

If he was concerned about staying the best, becoming the major leader he would make changes. That's what you do when you're focused on a particular goal. He would hire a world class physio, train in eight hour blocks, and fix the problems he has in his game. Right now I think he's only playing for the fans who clamor to see him on court and he doesn't want to disappoint them, but as for his own goals, he's satisfied with what he has done.

If it wasn't for the fans, I think he'd quit and go live his life.

It's hard to explain, but I understand it. I find it vulgar to chase about status. I don't feel that I need to prove anything to anyone and the thought of proving others wrong means nothing to me. When I was in karate my sensei wanted to make me his star pupil because I was a natural. But those were his dreams not mine and I felt no obligation to fulfill his desires. I didn't need to be a champion I was doing karate for myself. To strengthen my body and mind and push myself to its limits. I walked away when something else took my interest away. My sensei kept trying to get me to come back, but I had accomplished my goals and was done. The trophies that were gathering dust in my basement were put out in the trash, but what I'd done was inside of me.

A good example of Rafa's mindset was the AO 2009. After that grueling SF with Verdasco he was beat and wasn't going to play the final. If it hadn't been for Uncle Toni he wouldn't have competed at all. It was his relentless will to win at that time that got him through. Also, when he was beating Novak and Andy at a good clip, he always respected their talent. He never thought he was "better" than them but thought they were very worthy opponents. Many people don't understand that. They say, "he can't be that humble and be that good" but the opposite is true. No matter how good you are, the strength is in knowing both your strengths and weaknesses. To pretend that you have no weaknesses is foolish. And talking "confident" means nothing. If people are silly enough to buy into that, that's on them. Saying I'm not playing well is the truth, period. What's the point of saying otherwise? The thing about the fake it tll you make it, is BS to me. The problem with that attitude is that it's fake, how is that good? I don't think you need to assure people that you've still got it speaks to a need for validation. If I'm playing bad, I'm playing bad. Why would I have to need to convince others?

Rafa will ultimately decide whether he wants to go on and records, status, and history in the game will not be a priority for him. He will be satisfied with what he accomplished. Will he regret it later? He might, but if given the same choice I think he'd opt for the same decision.

Everyone is unique and no one is held to anyone else's standards. That's what so many people don't seem to understand. The only person you should ever choose to prove anything to is yourself, everything else is incidental.

Super post Lady TT.  One can't argue with thetruth...

Respectfully,
masterclass

Quote from: thetruth on August 13, 2015, 02:11:26 pm

Quote from: Clay Death on August 13, 2015, 09:08:26 am

Quote from: thetruth on August 13, 2015, 05:23:56 am

Rafa's level of play wasn't that good. He'll be out in the next couple of rounds, but what is encouraging is that he was engaged. But losing serve twice when serving for the set and match in a not-so-competitive match? Maybe there was a little improvement but the players ranked in the 40's will run him ragged.  He's going to have to train hard for the 2016 season if he wants to have a chance. The ? is, does he want it enough to do that?

agreed.

I remain worried.



my biggest worry is that he is going to get hurt and that will be the end.


I don't know why he is doing this. this is not rocket science.


he cant beat these guys with his current game and his remedial fitness.



I don't know why he cant train 7-8 hours a day. you break that into 2 long workouts.



what is the point in losing to these unknown players when he owned winning records against all of the top 30 players.



why go to battle unprepared.

It's so baffling in one way, but then again, it kind of backs up what he's been saying all along. I don't remember Rafa making claims that he wanted to be the greatest or even play after a certain point. I think he was satisfied with where he was and grateful to have gotten there, but the thought of chasing status never seemed to be a priority for him. That's what you need if you want to scale new heights. There's been many times that he's said that he wasn't trying to catch Federer and I think he meant it. He was playing for himself, not the history books.

In that sense he's already accomplished more than he ever dreamed of. Nothing about his background suggests that he would have the same ardor as other top players. As soon as a big tournament is over he heads straight back to Mallorca to relax with family and friends and work on his foundation.

He reminds me of Lleyton Hewitt so much. They both play for the love of the game and being competitive, not the love of external things. That's why they can accept losses so easily and continue to suit up. I think Rafa will play until he no longer enjoys it, but it will be for his reasons and no one else.

If he was concerned about staying the best, becoming the major leader he would make changes. That's what you do when you're focused on a particular goal. He would hire a world class physio, train in eight hour blocks, and fix the problems he has in his game. Right now I think he's only playing for the fans who clamor to see him on court and he doesn't want to disappoint them, but as for his own goals, he's satisfied with what he has done.

If it wasn't for the fans, I think he'd quit and go live his life.

It's hard to explain, but I understand it. I find it vulgar to chase about status. I don't feel that I need to prove anything to anyone and the thought of proving others wrong means nothing to me. When I was in karate my sensei wanted to make me his star pupil because I was a natural. But those were his dreams not mine and I felt no obligation to fulfill his desires. I didn't need to be a champion I was doing karate for myself. To strengthen my body and mind and push myself to its limits. I walked away when something else took my interest away. My sensei kept trying to get me to come back, but I had accomplished my goals and was done. The trophies that were gathering dust in my basement were put out in the trash, but what I'd done was inside of me.

A good example of Rafa's mindset was the AO 2009. After that grueling SF with Verdasco he was beat and wasn't going to play the final. If it hadn't been for Uncle Toni he wouldn't have competed at all. It was his relentless will to win at that time that got him through. Also, when he was beating Novak and Andy at a good clip, he always respected their talent. He never thought he was "better" than them but thought they were very worthy opponents. Many people don't understand that. They say, "he can't be that humble and be that good" but the opposite is true. No matter how good you are, the strength is in knowing both your strengths and weaknesses. To pretend that you have no weaknesses is foolish. And talking "confident" means nothing. If people are silly enough to buy into that, that's on them. Saying I'm not playing well is the truth, period. What's the point of saying otherwise? The thing about the fake it tll you make it, is BS to me. The problem with that attitude is that it's fake, how is that good? I don't think you need to assure people that you've still got it speaks to a need for validation. If I'm playing bad, I'm playing bad. Why would I have to need to convince others?

Rafa will ultimately decide whether he wants to go on and records, status, and history in the game will not be a priority for him. He will be satisfied with what he accomplished. Will he regret it later? He might, but if given the same choice I think he'd opt for the same decision.

Everyone is unique and no one is held to anyone else's standards. That's what so many people don't seem to understand. The only person you should ever choose to prove anything to is yourself, everything else is incidental.

Super post Lady TT.  One can't argue with thetruth...

Respectfully,
masterclass

Thanks Masterclass, that's really means a lot coming from you.

We're a small community here but we all offer a different perspective. I have learned so much from you and Clay about tennis in general, without the bells and whistles, just straight up truth, objectivity, and respect for each other and our faves.

This is a rarity in tennis communities where fans often feel that to like one player automatically means dissing their rival. But, the truth is, what we have been able to witness is otherworldly.

I thought I woul never see a player as smooth and effortless as Pete Sampras. Pete amazed me, because although you didn't think speed when he was on the court, he had it in a very understated way. The ball would be hit and Pete would be there.  I used to rewind often to see how he got there because my eyes had been deceived.

With Federer I didn't see that. I saw him getting to the ball so I didn't marvel at that. It looked normal to me. Federer's first years of winning big and consistently didn't impress me to be honest because the competition lacked in so many respects. For one, the guys all seemed to capitulate in his presence and willingly lie down. There was no reason for me to cheer. It wasn't until Rafa came around as the usurper that I began to see Federer as Federer, if that makes sense.

Before Federer didn't even (seemingly) have to work, because it was a sure thing that the opponent, even if they were playing well, would choke up the set or match.

Rafa changed the game as it pertained to Federer because for the first time Roger had a challenger. And the battles that they put on were jaw-dropping, strength and strength, two gladiators who both wanted the prize. It was a sight to behold.

The Wimbledon 2008 Final captured everything that tennis is supposed to represent at its highest level. I didn't want that match to end, but even more I knew that my heart would ache for the loser, because no one deserves to play that well only to lose in the end. That match changed my perspective because it showed me that beneath Federer's stoic demeanor was the same raging lion that we see in Nadal, only its represented in a totally different manner.

It also made me realize Federer's most important contribution to the game. When the competition was weak and players were saying, "It's OK to lose to Federer." I hated that and tennis became boring, but after that match I realized that had Federer not been so dominant and given the viewing public something to cheer for, the sport could've taken a huge hit in viewership.

That these two great titans understood and recognized what each was giving along with respect for their rival only sweetened the pot.

Anyone who can't see the greatness in both of them and choose to laud one and denigrate the other have no idea of the purpose of tennis in general. When Roger said a few years ago that he was playing better than he did when he was winning years ago, so many people scoffed. I was in total agreement, so when the critics said he was washed up, wouldn't win big again, I knew they were wrong and said so. And look at what has happened.

The day these two hang up their rackets will be a sad day for tennis fans all over the world.

Well said again Lady TT, and General Hercules what more can I say?

Well, I don't think anyone is really mentioning it, but I think Rafa's back or shoulder must clearly be affecting him.

He was just serving powder puff serves to Nishikori, who was playing like Davydenko of old played Rafa on hard courts. Taking the ball early and hitting with sharp angles and not giving Rafa time to set up anything.

He has almost no power on serve and has lost significant power on his forehand.
This is indicative of either a complete loss of fitness, or injury.

Fitness can be fixed.  Work very hard and it will return.
Injury on the other hand, you either play through it at reduced capacity or take the time off to heal.
With injury, you can't put in the hard work, or you risk further injury.
So based on what I've seen, I think he has been playing at reduced capacity due to injury.
Otherwise he would be more fit.

If injury is indeed the case, I think I would not play past the US Open, maybe not even play there.
He should take the time off to heal as well as possible, then return to training on clay, working as hard on his fitness as his body will allow.

He basically has no points to lose this year anyway.  Playing more only risks additional injury or aggravating whatever he has.

I would use the proven strategy of 2012-2013. Take the months off to heal injury, then work on fitness, and come back strong.
He will be rusty at first. So skip the Australian Open, and return on minor tournaments on clay in South America, and build match play and confidence just as he did in 2013. 

With this strategy, I think he can get back to the high level necessary for him to compete against the top players at Roland Garros and elsewhere. If he can dedicate himself to doing this, I wouldn't be surprised to see another couple of majors from him.

If that's what he wants, of course.  At some point, players do get sick and tired of fighting injury, having to get fit, the whole cycle, and call it quits.

I don't know if he has more desire in him to do more, or not, only he can answer that question.

Respectfully,
masterclass

great post general masterclass.


he just has no fitness and he does not put in the time on the practice courts.


nishikori got just 3 games from Andy and yet ran circles around Rafa.


he has to go get on clay or risk being out of the sport soon. one way or another he is out of the sport at this current rate.

and we have to face that reality.

next injury end the career.